tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32202893.post2778085319866355080..comments2023-10-18T08:32:17.510-07:00Comments on Kevin Hillstrom: MineThatData: Organic DemandUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32202893.post-46449685996052410512007-12-02T23:59:00.000-08:002007-12-02T23:59:00.000-08:00Thanks for an excellent post on a topic that is fr...Thanks for an excellent post on a topic that is frequently misunderstood. I enjoyed your post, as well as the related post by Jim Novo, so much, that I posted a comment <A HREF="http://fitzgeraldanalytics.wordpress.com/2007/12/03/why-use-control-groups/" REL="nofollow">here</A><BR/>Thanks again,<BR/>Jaime FitzgeraldAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32202893.post-62110284702313567662007-11-27T15:01:00.000-08:002007-11-27T15:01:00.000-08:00I find that if you're not a retailer with physical...I find that if you're not a retailer with physical stores, it is very hard to understand the concept of organic/ambient demand.<BR/><BR/>I've only found success when we execute mail/no-mail groups, and then review all the online demand that happens without catalog marketing.MineThatDatahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14014200122021988374noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32202893.post-57233337191750845022007-11-27T09:32:00.000-08:002007-11-27T09:32:00.000-08:00Well, Kevin did begin his post by saying that this...Well, Kevin did begin his post by saying that this is one of the least understood concepts in cataloging... I think that this probably holds true for other marketing channels as well. My question about an alternative classification for growth that cannot reasonably be tied to the metrics of a particular marketing effort was actually a genuine one. I hate to be one of those people who just points out problems without contributing solutions, but I honestly don't have an alternative. I just wonder if I'm misleading the decision-makers of my organization by describing the source of these sales as organic (or ambient, if you'd like). I think that this implies that we would bring in a certain baseline revenue without the current level of marketing investment. I haven't been in this line of work for long, but I have noticed that I have to be very careful about how I communicate anaytical results; even though I may speak quite strictly, others seem to hear loosely.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32202893.post-77166459002998225972007-11-26T06:14:00.000-08:002007-11-26T06:14:00.000-08:00Would "ambient" be perhaps a somewhat better term ...Would "ambient" be perhaps a somewhat better term than organic?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32202893.post-43457940378963388232007-11-25T20:48:00.000-08:002007-11-25T20:48:00.000-08:00I frequently use test/control or mail/holdout test...I frequently use test/control or mail/holdout tests to make my argument about organic demand. What might your alternative be?MineThatDatahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14014200122021988374noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32202893.post-42456282473453738202007-11-25T20:17:00.000-08:002007-11-25T20:17:00.000-08:00But let's go ahead and quibble, though... Just for...But let's go ahead and quibble, though... Just for the newbies' sake (myself included). I have recently used the term "organic demand" in directing management to discount some of the apparent benefit of a given marketing campaign. I think it is important to be able to quantify and acknowledge market share that is gained independently of timed efforts that we carefully track. Perhaps there is a better alternative than to bin un-earmarked sales as "organic"?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32202893.post-1611138171475610542007-11-24T23:18:00.000-08:002007-11-24T23:18:00.000-08:00Kevin,I actually wasn't trying to quibble over the...Kevin,<BR/>I actually wasn't trying to quibble over the definition of advertising. <BR/>My concern reading your post is that I know execs that would read that data and conclude they can cut advertising budget because..."no advertising" produced almost similar results as advertising did.<BR/>Paid advertising, while not always apparent and not always able to be tracked successfully, is necessary to grow sales. <BR/>Of course, all the advertising in the world doesn't do much if the quality of the product/service is not there. You pointed this out in a post not too long ago when you pointed out a session where you criticized the merchandiser in a board meeting. <BR/>In that way, the quality becomes a method of advertising. Not trying to quibble, but it is an issue when many companies are sacrificing quality for JIT inventory and low margin based solely on Chinese imports. <BR/>Of course that is another discussion...<BR/>Thanks for the posts, Kevin.<BR/>KAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32202893.post-30243095589619715712007-11-24T22:18:00.000-08:002007-11-24T22:18:00.000-08:00I suppose there are many different ways folks can ...I suppose there are many different ways folks can define advertising.<BR/><BR/>I could have been more specific, and listed catalogs, e-mail, paid search, affiliates, shopping comparison sites and portal/banner advertising as being in my definition of "advertising".MineThatDatahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14014200122021988374noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32202893.post-25753920332715888772007-11-24T22:09:00.000-08:002007-11-24T22:09:00.000-08:00Kevin,I find the term "no advertising" a misnomer....Kevin,<BR/>I find the term "no advertising" a misnomer. A brick and mortar store is advertisement in of itself. People drive by and see signs or the building itself. <BR/>With online stores, people come to www.cuddletown.com from advertising of some sort--they may have been referred to site by friends or blog reference, but the initial reference came from advertising of some sort. Perhaps you can't track back to a specific campaign, but advertising does grow sales even if not apparent at first.<BR/>KAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com